LEVER LOVERS.....THE COWBOY'S ASSAULT RIFLE

[Doc Wesson]

What do you want to hear in about em in a podcast???
go wild......

[Jens]

My personal wishlist would include reviews of different lever guns and comparisons of different calibers, especially when that particular caliber is available in a revolver as well - different loads for different barrel lengths, etc.

Just my $.02
Jens

[Doc Wesson]

Sind Sie das, das ich halte, aus Deutschland zu sehen? Gute Anträge! Ich spreche über sie! Danke!

[Dave.45]

Doc,
I am very much looking forward to you giving the lever actions a little love on the podcast. I have been tempted many times to purchase one (or two) but have not wanted to spend money on "the wrong gun." With that in mind, here are some show suggestions:
1) I think a historical brief would be helpful. A lot of levers are categorized by date which is confusing for the uninitiated.
2) Also, it would be nice to know the pluses/minuses of the various modern manufacturers.
3) What are the "real world" uses of the various calibers. e.g. if you are hunting deer (or Elk, or Bear), what calibers are options, what are the ballistic differences between .30-30, .44 Mag, .45-70 etc.
4) what would be a good B.O.B./truck/home defense lever gun?
Thanks for the time you put into these things, I always enjoy the show.

[Charlie Foxtrot]

.
1) A brief history of the lever (falling block, Volcanic, Henry, Winchesters (66, 73, 86, 92, 94....), Marlin, Savage, etc. etc.) with the cartridges typically used in the old warriors.  That should have them snoozing in the aisles.    Historical significance in the Old West.  Movie presence: i.e.: the ever popular Winchester 1892.  

2) Modern levers choices (Winchester clones, Henry, Marlins, Savages, Brownings, etc.)   Highlight the available calibers (22LRs through 45/70 and up) and types (carbine, rifles, guide guns, take-downs, etc.)

3) Modern use of the levers: Hunting, plinking, training, Cowboy Action, and self-defense (the friendly assault weapon) and even SHTF scenarios, where the pistol and carbine would have the same ammo. No-one shall mention Zombies.

Levers are affordable and reliable firearms, with a lot of benefits in the modern age.  

Looking forward to it!

[Jens]

Sind Sie das, das ich halte, aus Deutschland zu sehen? Gute Anträge! Ich spreche über sie! Danke!

Yes, I'm in Germany, but I'd prefer to keep this forum in English.

The .357 Magnum ammo I reloaded had been tailored for lever guns - small rifle primers, fast rifle powder (N110), and a light bullet. From the Rossi Puma 92 it kicked like factory ammo, but had an even flatter trajectory than HV ammo. From a Model 28-2 revolver the recoil was more of a shove than a kick, yet the flat trajectory remained. The way I see it most factory ammo is tailored for barrels of up to 6", starving the bullet in a longer barrel.

Jens

[CaptBullets]

In discussing level actions, don't forget the venerable Spencer.  While you had to manually manipulate the hammer, the loading and unloading action was with a level.

Brian

[tom]

What to look for in used vs. new.  Matching to a scope ie appropriate range of use.  Maintenance considerations.  Talk about the different feed mechanism: tube, box, etc.  but most important Doc, just get us more of your great shows.

tom

[marsbike]

I'd love to hear your thoughts (and possibly some load data) about the lesser mentioned rounds, like the .35 Remington.  I just picked up a marlin lever in .35 remington and I want to get some more info about it

[Jerome from California]

The two guns on my lever gun wishlist:
Ruger 96 in .22LR
Savage 99

[Charlie Foxtrot]

The two guns on my lever gun wishlist:
Ruger 96 in .22LR
Savage 99

Hey Jerome;

I found the Ruger 96 to be kinda clunky, and I'm a Ruger Fanboy.  Have you looked at the Winny 9422 or the Henry Yellowboy in 22LR?  Both are very sweet.  I own the 9422 and I'm lusting after the Henry.  

I never knew about the Savage 99, but that has got to be one of the most interesting lever designs.  The love child of a English double and an 1892.  Beautiful!  Strong smooth action?  

[Jerome from California]

Hey Jerome;

I found the Ruger 96 to be kinda clunky, and I'm a Ruger Fanboy.  Have you looked at the Winny 9422 or the Henry Yellowboy in 22LR?  Both are very sweet.  I own the 9422 and I'm lusting after the Henry.  

I never knew about the Savage 99, but that has got to be one of the most interesting lever designs.  The love child of a English double and an 1892.  Beautiful!  Strong smooth action?  

Re the 96, clunky in what way? Too bad because I figure it would be a great match with my 10/22 because they use the same magazine. I also liked the short lever throw. Oh well...

In my eyes the Savage 99 is the most elegant looking lever action ever. I'm sure the Browning BLR guys will disagree. Ha ha. Most 99s have a fixed magazine but the 99C model have a detachable magazine. The cartridge most associated with the 99 would be the .300 Savage and .303 Savage but I prefer the .308 Win for practicality. By all accounts, the action was strong enough to handle the hottest factory loads. Developing hot hand loads loads is not advised on most lever guns (the newer Marlins are probably the exception).

[bshupe]

Dank DOC, würde ich gerne hören über dem ursprünglichen design und wie es die Gewehr-Herstellung von der Zeit revolutioniert. Ich habe ein wenig darüber gelesen, aber von jemanden der Ihre Kaliber zu hören über es wäre wirklich toll.

[Charlie Foxtrot]

Hey Jerome;

I found the Ruger 96 to be kinda clunky, and I'm a Ruger Fanboy.  Have you looked at the Winny 9422 or the Henry Yellowboy in 22LR?  Both are very sweet.  I own the 9422 and I'm lusting after the Henry.  

I never knew about the Savage 99, but that has got to be one of the most interesting lever designs.  The love child of a English double and an 1892.  Beautiful!  Strong smooth action?  

Re the 96, clunky in what way? Too bad because I figure it would be a great match with my 10/22 because they use the same magazine. I also liked the short lever throw. Oh well...

In my eyes the Savage 99 is the most elegant looking lever action ever.

If you like the Ruger 96, get it!  I borrowed a 96 at the range years ago because I too loved my 10/22.  I just found that I liked the 9422 better.  And later, the Henry Yellowboy came into my life...

And the Savage 99 is just drop-dead gorgeous!  No longer being produced?  Damn.  Have to add it to the bucket gun list soon!

[Panhead Bill]

Calibers!  I'm clueless when it comes to rifle calibers (beyond 223 and 308). So I would love to hear a breakdown of calibers available for levers and (I know it could probably be a show in itself) what all the hyphenated calibers mean.  That would probably be too elementary for most of your listeners, but since you asked ....



Bill

[Daeglan]

I would love to know the difference between the 45.70, 45 colt and how they interchange between pistol and rifle.

[Charlie Foxtrot]

.
Well... the 45-70 looks to be a lengthened version of the 45 Long Colt, but it is not the case (pun fully intended.)  While the 45LC is a straight walled case, the 45-70 is slightly tapered. The 45LC also is regularly loaded with 240 or 260 gr bullets, the 45-70 is well into the 300 - 500 gr range, as well as being much more powerful: that's 70 grs of black powder!  

45LC was the original cartridge of the Colt Single Action Army revolver.  In later years the Winchester 1873 and 1892 lever actions and others were also chambered for it.  The 45-70 was originally chambered in the the Trapdoor Springfield and Shiloh Sharps rifles and carbines. There has been a handgun chambered for the 45-70, but it was intended for idiots with extremely strong wrists.  

Having a handgun and rifle that share the same cartridges helps with the logistics. However, a rifle/handgun cartridge is a compromise, you will likely have a stout load when fired in the handgun, but a relatively light one in the rifle.    

That being said, I'd feel well heeled with a Ruger .357 GP-100 on my hip, and a Marlin 94, also in .357, in my hands.  

Helps?

[Doc Wesson]

Working on this episode now........

[Charlie Foxtrot]

.
Lookin' forward to it, Doc.

Doc, don't shortchange the characters and stories that surround the design and production of the levers.  For example, I was floored to learn that the sainted John Moses Browning was the designer of many of the Winchester levers!

Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to You and Yours!
 

[Daeglan]

.
Well... the 45-70 looks to be a lengthened version of the 45 Long Colt, but it is not the case (pun fully intended.)  While the 45LC is a straight walled case, the 45-70 is slightly tapered. The 45LC also is regularly loaded with 240 or 260 gr bullets, the 45-70 is well into the 300 - 500 gr range, as well as being much more powerful: that's 70 grs of black powder!  

45LC was the original cartridge of the Colt Single Action Army revolver.  In later years the Winchester 1873 and 1892 lever actions and others were also chambered for it.  The 45-70 was originally chambered in the the Trapdoor Springfield and Shiloh Sharps rifles and carbines. There has been a handgun chambered for the 45-70, but it was intended for idiots with extremely strong wrists.  

Having a handgun and rifle that share the same cartridges helps with the logistics. However, a rifle/handgun cartridge is a compromise, you will likely have a stout load when fired in the handgun, but a relatively light one in the rifle.    

That being said, I'd feel well heeled with a Ruger .357 GP-100 on my hip, and a Marlin 94, also in .357, in my hands.  

Helps?

Yes muchly. Thanks. Seems to me a 45lc pistol and a 45lc lever would be a good combo for a trunk gun. As long as you understand the limitations.