1873 SAA Colt clone episode?

[oldjarhead]

Hey Doc. Have you ever considered doing an episode on the Colt 1873 SAA revolver and it's clones. With more and more people getting into Cowboy Action Shooting, I believe this would be a good show to do. I own a Cimarron Arms Pietta Frontier. 45 Colt myself, and it has the slickest, smoothest, best action on a single action Colt clone I have seen. I hope you give it some consideration. Thanks.

[Charlie Foxtrot]

+1 on the old Single Actions.

Maybe a survey on the old pistols of that era: The Colts, Remington, Merwin Hulberts, Smiths. Cap and ball and/or cartridge.   

Cowboy Shooter here, OJH. Uno Mas, SASS #80082. Double R Bar Regulators, Lucerne Valley, CA

YeeHaw!

[Doc Wesson]

Oh my friends.. I have wanted to do a series on singles... and yes that SAA would be the centerpiece..  Single actions.. the topic will either be the most listened to show.. or the least... because they are not black and plastic....
It will be coming.. just trying to figure out when..........

[Charlie Foxtrot]

   
Well, Doc -- let us thumb-busters help. 

And face it - your show centers around revolvers. So, you've already got the fossils listening.   

[SteveZ]

I'd love to hear something like this. I've got a USFA SAA and it's one of my favorite guns...well up the rung of my G19 or AR.

[Tennessee Jed]

I've wanted to hear Doc talk about single action revolvers for a long time.  Hasn't it been almost a year since the Wheel of Love episodes?  I think it is time.  I know I can't be the only listener that believes the single action revolver remains relevant in a society gone mad for plastic frames and magazines the size of small buckets. 

[Devereaux]

Yeah! Single Actions! THE guns that changed society forever.

No one buys plastic as heirlooms, or as fine anything. It is ONLY a cost and weight saver. But it is hardly art. Catch one of Steve Z's USFA's with their beautiful colour case hardened frames. Listen to the "click" as you cock those babies! The "Ting" sound of a Colt being cocked is UNIQUE. And they are actually WORTH something to own.

DO it, Doc! Talk about how the Paterson revolutionized the gun. Talk about the beauty of a Navy .36. Talk about how Remington turned revolvers on their heads with a solid frame. Talk about what Schofield did to make the S&W so much more practical.

Discuss the various new offerings of that venerable old gun. Sad to see most are foreign. But Colt has just issued yet another New Frontier - in .45 Colt and .44 Special ONLY. How cool is that!

[Tennessee Jed]

I'd also be interested to hear how CAS shooters shoot and reload their single actions.  I recently bought a Ruger Blackhawk that I am determined to learn to use effectively as a CCW handgun.  Yeah, I know...not modern, slow reloads, etc., etc.  I am not saying it's the best choice for this role, just that I want to learn how to use one in this role. 

I am convinced it can be done effectively.  I'm still on the learning curve, experimenting with different methods, and learning new things like this is always fun for me.  One thing I have learned so far is, life is too short to carry a handgun that you view only as an effective tool. 

[Doc Wesson]

Ok... will see what i can drum up...
I have a guest in mind for said topic... but it will be a big thing if I get him...
Would be a great show me thinks... at least.. you know I would love it...

[Dave.45]

Now you have me waiting anxiously too...
I loved the shows on the wheel guns. Single action is a hole in my collection that has never been filled. Every time I get the itch something else gets scratched instead. Maybe this will push me over the edge...

[Devereaux]

TJ - CAS shooters DON'T reload when they shoot. Instead they carry two guns, so you shoot 10 rounds using two guns. Loadings are limited to 5 rounds per gun, because of the pin-on-hammer for all the real Colts and true Colt clones. Ruger doesn't make a true clone as it has a floating pin and transfer bar.

When you load a SAA, you generally load one, skip one, load four, then cock the gun. It puts the empty under the hammer/pin. If you don't want to leave drag marks on the cylinder you ALWAYS cock the gun from the loading notch - it allows the cylinder to turn enough for the locking lug to fall into the lead groove.

If you bought an old (3-screw) Ruger, then you have the same loading notch on the hammer. If it's a new model, you unlock the cylinder by opening the loading gate. Only problem with that is that when you CLOSE the loading gate the locking lug drops - so you end up scoring the cylinder. Not an earth-shattering thing, but they look better without the drag marks. One modification you should consider if you have the new model is having a free-spin pawl installed. The gun as it comes clicks after the cylinder hole passes the loading opening. Most SAA shooters are accustomed to hearing and feeling the click, then turning the cylinder BACK to the stop, at which time the cylinder opening lines up with the gate.

[Charlie Foxtrot]

TJ;

Everything that Dev said, plus...

When I get back from a SASS match, the Single Actions go in the safe and the Glocks come out. The Glocks are nowhere near as beautiful, nor as interesting, as my Ruger SAs; they're just the best tools for the job of self defense. I think you can agree they've improved things a mite in 140 years.   

That being said, Gunsite teaches a course using the old thumb-busters as CCWs, and Michael Bane (Doc: hint, hint) has written on using "anachronistic" weapons in self defense/ survival situations. 

Defense and the Single Action I
Defense and the Single Action II

Interesting reading.  Michael has written before about the "assault" lever action and using CAS type shotguns when the ship hits the sands.  And there's a lot to be said for using what you're most familiar with, or what's handy.  Years ago, in my home town, an ol' coot cancelled an armed thug's life insurance policy using his grandpappy's Civil War Horse Pistol. In those simpler, less politically-correct, saner times, the old guy was roundly applauded. 

[Panhead Bill]

This topic was brought up with the perfect timing - I just jumped on the single-action bandwagon. Last week I purchased a Uberti 1873 Cattleman (SAA clone) in .45 LC and shiny nickel fnish (I think, I suppose it could just be a highly polished stainless). I get to pick it up (stupid CA laws) Tuesday after the ten-day wait is over.

I'm excited about this one - it'll be my first single action revolver. I was never really into them before, but after I got a lever action rifle a while back, I fell in love with that cowboy-style guns. Can't really explain it, there's just something about racking the lever before sending a big .44 caliber chunk of lead hurling downrange. It's the same with the SA revolver - they just come with a certain attitude.

Looking forward to your SA episode.

Bill

[Tennessee Jed]

Devereaux and Charlie ---- Thanks for the info you provided.  For some reason, I thought that occasional CAS events required shooters to reload on the clock, but looks like I was wrong.  I don't disagree with you, there are more efficient choices for defense than a SA revolver, and I don't intend to give up on my more modern handguns.   

I took the Blackhawk to the range over the weekend, shooting 225 grain wadcutters at around 1000 fps or so, and there is something VERY satisfying about the large boom, the push of the recoil, and punching large holes through the bullseye.  I find myself shooting my more modern handguns because I should, but shooting the Blackhawk for the sheer joy of it.       

       

[Charlie Foxtrot]

Well --- never say never.  I've been in competitions where the shooter had to load  single round in order to shoot the last target.  Since we normally only load 5 in our six shooters, it was fairly easy -- not.  Open the gate, spin the cylinder to find the open chamber, shuck in the shell, advance the cylinder 4 chambers, close the gate, and shoot. Hopefully. Clicking through 5 dead chambers is rather embarrassing.

I've heard of a match where the shooters had to reload their pistol for 5 additional shots. On the clock. Afterwards, the stage designer was invited out back of the clubhouse -- and never heard from again. (As he tells it.)

Panhead and TJ, if you think plinking with your six-guns is fun, we've gotta get you out to a SASS match!  Nothing better than racing 2 six-guns, a lever, and a splattergun with some of the finest people who ever burned gunpowder. Most fun you can have with your spurs on!        

[Devereaux]

TJ -

Actually, there is no rule that prohibits one from reloading. However, since you are on the clock, no one does. Every once in a Blue Moon (Extra Full Moon in a month) there will be a scenario wherein you are required to shoot your 10, then reload ONE (1) and shoot it. It is more common with the rifle, but some scenarios will call for a pistol reload. It is always interesting then to see just how people figure out how to do it. One friend of mine had a Ruger and he made a mark on the cylinder so the if you placed the round in the empty chamber then rotated the cylinder to the mark, you could cock the hammer and have the NEW round ready to shoot.

I have always harbored a secret desire to shoot a match with only one pistol. If I owned an Uberti Schofield I would actually try that, since reloading one of those is a lot easier than the traditional Colt. But then, in the REAL West very few actually carried 2 guns. I have also wanted to live somewhere where I could practice "hip" shooting, then shoot a match that way, instead of the more useful way of extending your arm and aiming at your target. Would be fun, if for no other reason than it was what I grew up watching on TV. Not that it's practical, just "interesting". And cowboy shooting will often allow you to do the "interesting" - at least if you shoot at a local match. As things stand, I shoot a category called Gunfighter, which is the ONLY category where you can draw BOTH guns and shoot them alternately. All the other categories require you to draw ONE gun at a time and shoot it to dry, then holster and draw the other. Everyone says it's harder since you have to shoot left and right handed, but I think it's just fun. And I'm not in it to win the match anyway, just have a good time.

[Devereaux]

What CF said! Go watch a match and see if you might like to do that. Often you will find people that will lend you their guns and ammo to try out shooting a scenario, just for kicks. Friendly people!

[Charlie Foxtrot]

 
Hey Dev: you shoot Modern or the stinky stuff? 

[Tennessee Jed]

One of these days I'm going to have to start shooting CAS, because I am gradually heading in that direction anyway.  In the past couple of years, I've picked up a Ruger Blackhawk, Stoeger Coach Gun, and an old Marlin 1894...not to mention a copy of Marty Robbins' "Gunfighter Ballads and Trail Songs". 

[Devereaux]

CF - smokeless. Really haven't wanted the hassle of cleaning as soon as I get home. I pretty much hate cleaning, and you can't procrastinate when you shoot black. Or so I'm told.

TJ - Do it! Hopefully the 94 is in pistol calibre (that's another little idiosyncrasy of cowboy shooting - they don't allow rifles in riffle calibre). You might want to find another Blackhawk. I will from time to time shoot my AWA SAA's - one is 4=5/8" barrel and the other 7-1/2". Makes for some interesting shooting, but it isn't illegal, and it can be fun too. Those old cavalry type Colts are kind of cool. I generally like the short barreled ones, but I have gotten a liking to longer barrel single actions. Even have an old Ruger 3-screw in .357 Mag with a long barrel. AND a Single Six with the WRM cylinder too in something like 7-1/2". Helps make the .22 WRM shoot more of its potential. (And it was the right price - I think I paid something like $250 for it).

Oh, BTW, if your 94 is not in pistol calibre, you can from time to time find side matches in rifle calibre to shoot it. But you will need a pistol calibre rifle.