Episode 191 - Has Colorado Changed You?

[Bob Mayne]

Active shooter situations like the recent Aurora Colorado movie theater shooting and the recent shooting at the Sikh Temple in Wisconsin seem to really make people stop and think about their safety and how they plan to keep themselves safe. They almost always lead to more gun sales and more ammo sales. The main topic of this episode is a discussion of how the shooting in Colorado has changed my outlook on concealed carry, training and self defense. How has it changed you? This episode also begins with some listener voice mails.  Please use this thread for comments and questions.

[nate]

I think one thing I have thought a lot about is something Michael Bane has discussed many times on his podcast.  To put it simply-can you make the shot? That can be applied to any number of things, and even non-firearm tasks.  It simply means what can you be counted on to produce in any circumstance.  Things like a smooth draw from the holster, trigger and trigger finger control, breaking the shot accurately and quickly if necessary. It's great to be able to draw from concealment standing-but can you do it sitting? in the car? laying on your back? with one hand?  Can I put an acceptable shot on target on demand? I'm not talented at putting thoughts to paper and would suggest just listening to Down Range Radio, but that has been on my mind in light of recent events.

[Southern Yankee]

Night shooting, I will be doing a lot more of it. I have always kept an eye on the emergency exits in theaters, but I will be checking that they are shut from now on. I will also be closing it behind anyone who may go out of it.

[Kwah]

Night Shooting!!!
I have done some training but after careful retrospect I know I need more.

[The Grizzly Gunny]

Ever since I got into guns my wife has been very resistant, she has a "not in our neighborhood" attitude. Due to her resistance i was always been very hesitant to carry, also because the only hand gun i had was a S&W 686 in .357. It was very large and a didn't really feel i could conceal it sufficiently. Recently i sold that gun with intentions to get a compact 9mm. Then this shooting happened, I now care every day. It's only a 22 until i can get a hold of the gun i want, but it's what I have. After carring every day for about a month my wife noticed I was carrying. The first words out of her mouth were "Why do you have the gun?" in a less than pleased tone (did I mention it's her gun?). My only response, "You know why." I urge anyone who thinks about carrying to not be shy about it any more. Get a gun and wear at all times, if you can handle the mindset required.

[Bob Mayne]

After carring every day for about a month my wife noticed I was carrying. The first words out of her mouth were "Why do you have the gun?" in a less than pleased tone (did I mention it's her gun?). My only response, "You know why."

My response would have been...."because I can't carry a Cop!"

Or...."movie theater in Colorado. Is there a better reason?"

[SirBrass]

After carring every day for about a month my wife noticed I was carrying. The first words out of her mouth were "Why do you have the gun?" in a less than pleased tone (did I mention it's her gun?). My only response, "You know why."

My response would have been...."because I can't carry a Cop!"

Or...."movie theater in Colorado. Is there a better reason?"

That was essentially my response to someone who asked me why I wanted to fly with my firearms down to a friend's wedding in KY this past weekend.  My response was simple, "Principle and prudence."  And that's exactly what it was.  I carry 24/7 b/c of the sheer principle of the thing (also read as "sheer bloodymindedness") and also b/c it is simply prudent to do so, aka "Be prepared" (have I mentioned I'm an Eagle Scout?).

[sdprof]

The episode in Aurora, and now the shooting at the Sikh temple in Wisconsin, only harden my belief that bad stuff can happen any where, any time, no matter how safe a place might seem to be. I'm not going to go all tacticool mall ninja and carry 15 pounds of gear, but I will carry always. And be more on the watch for things and people out of place.

To those who think one person with one handgun wouldn't make a difference, keep in mind that most rampage shooters are cowards at heart. Why else would they choose places where there's little likelihood of victims being armed? If they are met with any resistance, it's likely they will at least be stalled for some time as they process the change in situation, and may well break off an run. The fellow in Wisconsin probably had a more determined mindset, but still he'd be delayed at least a little.

Keep up the good work, Bob, looking forward to the next many years of good info.

[bart11]

Copied from my Facebook response:

One change has been the language and word choices I make. When discussing this mass killing, I choose to use the words, "killing" and "killer" rather than "shooting" and "shooter." I go shooting and consider myself a "shooter." I do not like to see negative associations made in the public's mind from these killings.

Bart

[The Grizzly Gunny]

I choose to use the words, "killing" and "killer" rather than "shooting" and "shooter." I go shooting and consider myself a "shooter." I do not like to see negative associations made in the public's mind from these killings.

Bart

I have to agree Bart. It seems like semantics, and of little consequence to some, but I really despise the way the term "active shooter" is used in most settings today. Used, I might add, by many in the gun community as well. It's time to change the words we use, because as I'm sure Bob will agree, words mean something. They reflect our state of mind. I am a shooter, and active in my pursuit of better shooting skills, because it pays to be prepared. (I'm also an eagle scout! I'm seeing a trend with shooters and past scouting experience.)

[Goldenboy]

I used to wonder if I'm being overly paranoid for conceal carrying at church.   My reasoning was that I don't just go to church and go home.   Church is usually followed by brunch, grocery shopping etc. so,I'm out all day.   So unless I want to be without my gun all day or leave it in my car, I have to carry in the church.   It's not as if I'm thinking, time for church, where's my gun?

But now, after the Sikh temple  shooting, it just shows that there is no place where I can take my safety for granted.   That no matter where I am, I have to keep an eye on the entrance and exits. 

[SirBrass]

I carry in church, and several folks there, including the elders (no actual proof they do, but I doubt they're unaware that I do) know I do. It's not b/c someone who attends might try something (I REALLY doubt that), but that an outside threat would target us (it's actually probable due to circumstances I'm not at liberty to speak of). Not to mention it comes back to simple prudence. It's a public gathering of many people who will be focused on a preacher or on singing or praying, and there are a good number of children and toddlers there not counting the ones in the nursery. It makes a juicy target for one with a violent axe to grind against Christianity or certain Christians in particular, or just someone who wants to shatter the sense of peace present in a small congregation.

So, even if I didn't have information that someone specifically wished us ill and may have the lack of lucidity to think he could try something nasty, sheer prudence says that a gathering like that should have at least one, preferably more men armed and trained keeping an eye out for the people there.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S3

[ExpatBen]

I've decided to go back to carrying a light on my pistol.  I use to always and then let several people talk me out of it.  If I have to fight at night or in a darkened theater I would much rather have my weapon mounted light then not.  I'm also going to go hang out in the dark more often.  I use to love working at night.  It has advantages and disadvantages that I use to love working with.  A lot of the problem with working or fighting at night is getting use to it.  In our normal everyday lives with deal with the dark by turning on a light.  I need to learn to embrase the darkness again.

[iMotoPilot]

The shootings in Colorado have caused me to finally purchase a handgun and soon enough concealed carry.  Your great show was brought to my attention by a fan & motorcycle rider friend of mine.   Look forward in taking a few classes with you Bob.

Saludos!


J

[Bluesteel]

Hey Bob,

 I want to thank you for doing a great job on the podcast and really getting a lot of great information out to people. I have always felt fairly cautious going to places and trying not to be a victim. Since Colorado it has made me more aware of my surroundings. I need to pay attention to in places I felt safe or a place you wouldn't think something like a theater shooting would happen. I am looking for exits, watching people, running situations through my head and how I would react all while being out with family or by myself. I'm sure you have heard about the copy cat shooter they caught in Maine. I do everything I can to educate my friends and family about CHL and to not be a victim. The thought of "it won't happen to me" is far to risky to not do something about it. I attached the story for the potential shooter captured, and then another story about how the swiss are pro gun and makes people more responsible and lower crime rate. Thanks for everything you do and keep up the good work.

Link to copy cat shooter captured: http://rt.com/usa/news/police-copycat-batman-massacre-932/

Link to swiss guns making low crime rate: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/1566715.stm

[Bob Mayne]

The shootings in Colorado have caused me to finally purchase a handgun and soon enough concealed carry.  Your great show was brought to my attention by a fan & motorcycle rider friend of mine.   Look forward in taking a few classes with you Bob.

Saludos!


J

Congratulations and thanks for listening.  It's always good to hear of another taking responsibility for their own safety. Looking forward to training with you.

[Bob Mayne]

Hey Bob,

 I want to thank you for doing a great job on the podcast and really getting a lot of great information out to people. I have always felt fairly cautious going to places and trying not to be a victim. Since Colorado it has made me more aware of my surroundings. I need to pay attention to in places I felt safe or a place you wouldn't think something like a theater shooting would happen. I am looking for exits, watching people, running situations through my head and how I would react all while being out with family or by myself. I'm sure you have heard about the copy cat shooter they caught in Maine. I do everything I can to educate my friends and family about CHL and to not be a victim. The thought of "it won't happen to me" is far to risky to not do something about it. I attached the story for the potential shooter captured, and then another story about how the swiss are pro gun and makes people more responsible and lower crime rate. Thanks for everything you do and keep up the good work.

Link to copy cat shooter captured: http://rt.com/usa/news/police-copycat-batman-massacre-932/

Link to swiss guns making low crime rate: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/1566715.stm

Excellent post and links.  Glad to have you as part of our community here at the GRRN.

[NWLA-Neil]

Bob,
Thanks for the great show.  This episode was especially insightful to me, like it was to the other listeners, because it focused on a specific event.  I have been concerned about a church shooting ever since the event at the Colorado church a few years ago.  Church is a place ripe for a killing spree because the attention is focused on one place, and usually the sanctuaries are designed to focus attention away from exits, and on the stage.  A friend of mine who is a deacon just brought this up in their latest meeting.  It would be a good idea to have some "shooters" in the congregation be trained to confront a "killer" if the situation should arise.  Training would be a must, because of the high concentration of people in the room.  Any ideas out there for instructors who teach this type of thing?

[Bob Mayne]

I worry about being in church too.  I'm always armed.  If you take a few good tactical classes like CRG from Suarez International, Tom Given's classes, Tiger McKee, etc., classes like that and Active Shooter/Terrorist Interdiction (Suarez International) you should learn some skills that will help you a great deal.  Last year we had some people from a church security team come through one of our classes.

The church I attend has a lot of exist easy to access, but my pastor is kind of controversial and I worry about it quite a bit actually.

[SirBrass]

Our church is an old building but up to code, but there are at least 4.... make that 5 entrances through which an active killer could come through, and when I'm sitting forward, I've got clear sight lines to 4 of them, but the main entrance where an active killer would have a direct sight line to the preacher in the pulpit is the only one with such a sight line, and up until the sermon I've got essentially the "guard dog" spot (I run the audio, which puts me in an ideal place to see who is coming in or out of ALL the entrances).

I've thought about sight lines and how to engage an active killer from me being positioned either in the congregation or in the audio room, and that includes considering a degree of panic from folks (not all of us are sheep there so I don't expect mass panic, but there will be some degree of confusion and fear and pandemonium) that I'll have to account for.

Which is why I'm glad certain folks are generally aware that I'm one who carries a gun.  Because if stuff does hit the fan, there's going to be folks there who will be unsurprised to see a gun in my hand.